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Suing developers

Posted: 10 Feb 2014 20:45
by pamccann1
We've recently been contacted by NDS lawyers re suing our developer for not pushing the issuance of title deeds. Obviously they will require a sizeable fee for doing this. Does anybody know of these lawyers and has anybody had a similar approach??

Paul Mc

Re: Suing developers

Posted: 10 Feb 2014 22:06
by Pantheman
pamccann1 wrote:We've recently been contacted by NDS lawyers re suing our developer for not pushing the issuance of title deeds. Obviously they will require a sizeable fee for doing this. Does anybody know of these lawyers and has anybody had a similar approach??

Paul Mc
Dont bother, you would be throwing good money after bad. If the develop is skint, what do you hope to gain. The only thing is to have had your complaint logged. You are covered by the specific performance law to get your deeds.

I doubt very much they do much for you. This is similar to asking fir 5k up front to get your deeds quicker scam, know anyone who managed to get them by this method? Thought not.

That's my opinion anyway.

Good luck

Re: Suing developers

Posted: 11 Feb 2014 00:14
by pamccann1
Thanks for the swift replies, it pretty much confirms the way my mind was going.
NDS have taken over the property dealings of Pittjadis law.

Re: Suing developers

Posted: 18 Dec 2014 10:57
by SteliosAl
Hi everyone

Isn't it unfair to us young professionals at NDS when everyone comments based on assumptions or whatever else?

I wish to clarify that suing the developers will not solve the title deed issue in most cases. This is clearly explained to everyone depending on the circumstances of the case. However, it is the only means that will provide any real chances of the developers proceeding and actually acting upon the issuance of the title deeds. Again, depending on the circumstances of the case. It is very probable that the developers will not even bother even if legal proceedings initiate, especially if the financials are very bad. You cannot force the issuance of the title deeds.

@pamccann1 If you could please contact and give me specifics of the case perhaps I can explain. Certainly, you must be having issues with the issuance of the deeds and proceeding legally may be the only way of pushing the developer to act upon it. This is no guarantee but certain developers have indeed acted when faced with legal proceedings. I am sure that no person at NDS has pushed you to proceed legally. I am probably the person you have talked to and I merely provide possible options, and there are not many..

Furthermore, the legal fees for civil proceedings in Cyprus are low, compared to the rest of the European countries. It is utterly silly to compare a certain ''5K upfront fee title deed scam'' with this.

@Nigel Howarth You are a professional in the field and well respected. We have never met. Perhaps it is better to meet and have a chat before assuming that ''There are a number of lawyers chasing business - both in Cyprus and the UK and it is best to ignore them''. Is there anything wrong in chasing business by the way?

Yes, we have taken upon the administration of some of the Pittadjis Law Firm files, nothing more and nothing less.

We are not selling ''legal proceedings for title deeds'' because this is the impression I get from these posts.

PLEASE, I urge everyone to stop assuming. The majority of lawyers are professional and ethical and many act upon 'Filotimo' - friend of honor, taking nothing in return! You cannot put everyone in the same basket. Especially, young and motivated professionals in Cyprus. This country needs them!

I cannot comprehend the fact that the salaries us lawyers have here are at 1/3 or even 1/4 of my colleagues in Germany and the UK and certain other countries, yet we are expensive, taking advantage etc etc.

I wish I could ''fix'' all the title deed issues but I cannot.

Stelios Alexandrou
NDS Lawyers

Re: Suing developers

Posted: 18 Dec 2014 16:13
by Nigel Howarth
Hi Stelios welcome to the forum.

When people have problems that require legal advice, I suggest they contact a lawyer on the list provided by the British High Commission in Nicosia.

It will probably be worth your while seeing if you can get your company added to the list.

Regrettably more than three quarters of the problems people refer to me could have been avoided had their lawyer advised them correctly and ensured that their interests were properly protected. Even Antonis Loizou recognises there's a problem with lawyers as you can see from his article Well meaning or crooked lawyers?.

As for 'touting for business' - Nothing wrong with it, but I would be very wary of anyone cold calling and/or asking me to publish articles publicising their company. I would use someone with a proven track record. (I have stopped publishing articles from law firms dealing with the Swiss Franc home loans issue - as soon I published an article from one firm, an article arrived a couple of days later from one of the other firms.)

I agree that Cyprus needs young and motivated professionals - particularly lawyers who will do their utmost to protect the interests of those buying property.


Re: Suing developers

Posted: 18 Dec 2014 19:19
by SteliosAl
Hi Nigel

Ofourse there are problems with lawyers. That cannot be denied. Whether it's in Cyprus or elsewhere. I can provide thousands of reports and cases from all over the EU. This does not make the Cyprus lawyers any worse or more crooked in general. People need to wake up.

I don't agree with individuals talking nonsense about law firms who they have never heard of. NDS is not 'Neocleous', we are a relatively new small law firm and certainly having never heard of us does not mean that we are not competent.

This 'thing' with many individuals in Cyprus whenever they hear the word 'lawyer'and 'property' is becoming comical. Reminds me of Sacha Baron Cohen's character, Borat and his reaction and facial expression whenever he hears the word 'jew'!

I have met numerous people and clients that have been misinformed through forums and websites and by what anyone and everyone says!

Anyway, I have merely googled the law firm and the third result is the thread from this forum. This is obviously not good and most importanly, the comments are untrue, unfounded and damaging.

We have only positive feedback by all clients and it is unfair as the forum-thread is indirectly damaging. Ofcourse, the natural reaction and replies by readers and even experienced individuals like you is negative. 'Stay away' etc etc etc as if we are some scamming company.

We have not yet added the firm to the British High Commission but on our website you will see client feedback that has been sent to the High Commission.

Also, the truth is that the British High Commission list does not make the law firms any better or credible. Essentially, it is also a kind of a marketing scheme. You will hear and read negative feedback on many firms, whether they are on the list or not. This includes law firms globally.

I hope you can understand me. I am very clear.



Re: Suing developers

Posted: 18 Dec 2014 20:51
by Nigel Howarth
Hi Stelios,

I have removed my comments.

I agree that there are problems with lawyers in other countries. But unlike other jurisdictions where people can easily check a solicitor's record to see if there have been any complaints and the judgements of the regulators, the Cyprus Bar Association Disciplinary Board's decisions are shrouded in secrecy. I asked for a list of their decisions some time ago and they didn't even have the courtesy to reply.

But to give you an idea of the problems I receive - one today from a chap who bought a property nearly 30 years ago says that 7 different lawyers have led him into what he describes as a "fruitless dance".

Another one a few days ago where a lawyer at the eastern end of the island is trying to charge someone who wants to change to another lawyer - €75/annum for storing their file plus a further €50 for replying to their email request.

There is a well-known lawyer in Paphos who had 22 cases to be heard in front of the Bar Association's Disciplinary Committee. One case, which was widely publicised in the media, resulted in a paltry €1,000 fine - that's the maximum fine (I believe) that the Disciplinary Committee can impose. It's hardly a deterrent and was probably less than she charged the client to begin with.

I've heard from a number of his clients that there is another lawyer in Paphos who records conversations of people in his waiting room.

Whatever you may think about the British High Commission's list, they do require lawyers to sign up to conditions - and if they break those conditions, they're struck off.

I know that there are many honest lawyers in Cyprus - I've met several - and they're kept very busy. But the problem is that the 'bad apples' are allowed to get away with it.

The Cyprus Bar Association operates more like a trade union for lawyers rather than a body protecting the interests of their clients. As far as I am aware its Disciplinary board is comprised solely of lawyers with no independent lay people who may wish to inject some 'realism' into their discussions.


Re: Suing developers

Posted: 19 Dec 2014 01:32
by SteliosAl
Hi Nigel

I completely agree with you regarding the Cyprus Bar Association Disciplinary Board.

The lawyers you are referring to with examples do exist. You can't get rid of idiots and they should be disciplined.

I am now defending all the professionals of Cyprus because the notion of 'crooked' is widely associated with us. Cyprus has economically become what it is because of a handful of people. Not because of the honest hard working individuals ie. the majority of the population. Yes there are crooked professionals, the minority. Unfortunately, they take everyone down with them.

Since you have mentioned punishment; I am a lawyer, but I am also Cypriot. The big players of the EU looking down upon us are not any better. They can just get away with it because they are more powerful. The biggest power on this planet is as corrupt as it gets. It can drop bombs anytime anywhere for economic interests but instead of being criticized it receives support from the allies. Now that is the epitome of corruption.

Unfortunately, systems are rotten everywhere and I have difficulties in accepting the attitude of many comments regarding Cyprus and its hard working people that are currently facing great difficulties.

Regarding the person who has seen 7 different lawyers, I can take a look on his case (no charges). However, I very much doubt that something can be done. If there was a solution one of the lawyers he has seen would have found it already. Perhaps, there is no way out and the lawyers are not to blame?

Lastly, the legal fees. I have colleagues - friends in the UK and Germany. The legal fees are much higher there. They charge for every email, telephone call and virtually every note they take upon cases as this is how the charging system functions. Yet, we are also accused for overcharging etc! There are many 'urban myths' regarding professionals in Cyprus.